In this first of two parts, my husband Danny and I do a double feature review of Koji Shiraishi’s other Lovecraftian mockumentaries, Occult (2009) and Cult (2013). We’re analyzing the societal themes of these frightening movies, and getting to the bottom of which one is closer to Shiraishi’s masterpiece, Noroi. Be sure to tune in tomorrow for the second half of this cult conversation. I’ve pasted the transcript below in case anyone would rather read than listen.

Host: It’s the movie hotline and I’m back with the editor Danny and we’re doing a double feature analysis of Koji Shiraishi’s mockumentary horror films Cult and Occult. Occult—I have trouble saying that word, how do you pronounce it?

Danny: Occult.

Host: Occult, okay. We always seem to watch these two movies together, is that correct?

Danny: That is correct

Host: Yes, , and I would put them together on a shelf underneath Noroi, which we both agree is a masterpiece. But I prefer Cult and you prefer Occult.

Danny: That is correct.

Host: And we’re going to talk about that and we’re going to try to hash out which one is closer to being—to having like the director’s signature on it, sort of like the auteur theory of horror. So we’ll start with Occult. Can you give me like an elevator pitch on what the movie’s about?

Danny: An elevator pitch? I don’t know.

Host: You mentioned some elevator music in the movie.

Danny: There was some elevator music, Alone Again (Naturally). It’s a movie—yeah, it’s a mockumentary about like a ritualistic murder that randomly happens on a bridge and it starts following one of the survivors and he’s not all that he seems and he’s hearing voices and you know something bad’s about to happen.

Host: Okay, so what would you say is maybe not your favorite, but the scene from this movie that stands out to you?

Danny: That would have to be like the last I would say about 15 or so minutes of the movie, like the day of the ceremony—which is, sorry for spoilers here, that the guy that was wounded in the attack, the survivor, is planning on doing a mass bombing, a mass suicide bombing I should say.

And this kind of lead-up to it, the movie is a very slow-paced movie, maybe too slow for some, but it’s fine for me. But that last 15 minutes, that slow build really just kind of amps up your anxiety because you know it’s going to happen, you’re just not entirely sure when. And then when it does, the movie doesn’t quite prepare you for that with the rest of the stuff. The murders and stuff are really not shown very graphically and such, and the bombing itself is quite—can be a little a little hokey, but it was a—it was very unsettling at the same time. I think that’s the highlight of the movie for me is that actual event happening. It’s very disturbing.

Host: Now, what would you say if you were talking about this movie being about something else? Say it’s about this crazy guy that’s planning to do a bombing, but if somebody was taking the movie Occult and making a point about society or culture, what point would they be making?

Danny: There’s definitely like a play on like religious cults and stuff like that because Japan has had a lot of history with cults, much like the United States. The—was it a train bombing I think in the ’90s, sarin gas or something? I forget what it was exactly, I’ve had a couple of beers, sorry.

I think it’s definitely about religious fanaticism and how it’s not always—you can be easily misled, I guess. Like the main guy in this, you almost want to feel sorry for him, but you can’t because he’s a loser. He’s a good elite loser, and he doesn’t think he’s bad, but you know, he just—he’s greedy. He’s very self—all about himself, selfish. Like it’s brought up in the movie where he asked him like why does he think that this bombing, you know, why would it be okay for him to kill all these other people? And he like really doesn’t answer that, he just, you know, chants his mantra because it’s like, good things, if he does this, good things are going to happen to him. And he doesn’t care about anybody else or who it’s affecting as long as he gets his reward for it.

Host: Now, why do you think—and we forgot to mention that Koji Shiraishi plays a fictional version of himself in this film, and he ends up becoming mesmerized by this loser as you say, and helping him with the bombing, but kind of paying lip service to trying to stop him the whole time. Why do you think that he chose to put himself into that part and play himself as opposed to in Noroi where he had an actor play Kobayashi the documentarian?

Danny: I think part of it might have to do with the budget being much smaller. There’s not as many locations or set pieces here, so that might be part of it. Or maybe he just wanted to act, you know, that’s a possibility as well. But he does a great job at it, and he shows that his fictional version of himself is not a loser like Eno is—the guy that was wounded, his name was Eno. But he is just as weak as he is, as it really doesn’t take a whole lot for him to suddenly be all on board for this. It really doesn’t. Yeah, you could stand there and you could sit there and see some guy with worms for heads going around and you’re gonna freak out and bleed from your leg, but that still ain’t going to make me want to go and help with a bombing, sorry.

Host: That’s a very concise way to put it. I have to say that when it comes to Occult, you said that you almost felt sorry for the bomber Eno. I think now that we’ve watched these two movies back to back, I think that this might be in fact the better movie, but I hate that guy so much. Like, he doesn’t have any kind of humility. It doesn’t go along with the culture that we’ve come to expect from Japan—the manners, the politeness, the collectivism, the good kind of collectivism where they’re looking out for what’s best for everyone. He has this look on his face that I see with the worst kind of misogynists that are entitled, and I hate the way that he talks to the woman that’s on the team for the documentary.

But—and this is something I also can’t stand—her. She’s annoying, she’s abrasive, and she doesn’t do anything to stop them. That’s the main thing that I don’t understand is how they all seem to be controlled by this entity and everybody knows—all the main four people in the film know what he’s fixing to do, but they don’t do anything to stop him.

Danny: Yeah, I was going to bring up a thing about during—there is one scene where he’s drawing—Eno is drunk and he’s verbally abusing the female producer who’s also the interviewer. And you know, here, that’d be like a slap fight going on right then and there, a glass beside the head. But there, you know, she’s showing humility, she leaves, she tries not to cause a scene while Eno is pure trash. And that’s—and it—that’s the true self popping out of him. He tries to hide it very badly, but he’s drinking—when he’s drinking in particular, he’s just that, he’s a complete ass.

Host: So what would you say ties this movie most to Noroi in terms of the director’s signature? It could be a theme or it could be an effect.

Danny: You know, there’s his—his love of like this Eldritch tentacle—it’s not tentacle, it’s more worms and such like that is kind of—let me—

Host: Leeches.

Danny: Leeches, that’s right, leeches. It’s—they’re all kind of like all together, and even in Cult, which we’ll talk about later or here in a few minutes, there’s even that same kind of thing going on with the worms and such.

Host: Oh hell, we ran too long! We enjoyed talking to each other so much that we went on for 26 minutes, so I’m going to cut it here and come back with the Cult portion of the video tomorrow. Stay tuned!